Forum Overview :: Gamerasutra
 
Let me assist your memory using mine by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 10:33am PDT
Which of course selects the extremes. Note that virtually every exceptionally bad mission could have been salvaged with even a basic checkpoint system, which goes back to my point that sandbox games can fuck a lot of things up with me until I become convinced that I am wasting time on the hamster wheel of their arrogance. That plus GTA4's reluctance to allow me to apply any of my possible tools in most required missions make the game unplayable for me.


Missions of Note
In a good way:
-Three leaf clover and most McReary activites apart from the stupid girlfriend, and I liked Derrick's missions as well.
-Some of the little Jacob stuff, which down to the helicopter RPG duel was about on par with SR2 for cartoonish absurdity
-Some of the Dwayne/Playboy missions, which again were about on par with the average shenanigans in SR2
-The Gambetti family mission to kill Kim, where despite being slathered in stereotypes they made sure it mattered whether I did my job well and got to him before he got to his vehicle (this one's fresh on my memory because I happened to do it the other day when I tried the game again just to be sure I hated it. Phil Bell was again the end of that visit).

In a bad way:
-Two motorcycle invulnerability chase
-One car invulnerability chase
-Any other chase with invulnerable segments
-Chick in the trunk
-Any mission which began with multiple driving segments that you had to repeat if you failed
-and on that note, Phil Bell and his suicidal run into the warehouse which was based around the worst infiltration plan in the universe
-Any mission which concluded with a bullshit kill him or let him live choice (many)
-Any mission which required you to conduct an absolutely ridiculous betrayal/act of scumbaggery that was not only a bad thing to do generally, it was the opposite of -pragmatism and common sense (many).
-Ray Boccino and his sidekick Johnny, the worst diamond thieves
-Bernie Crane, which by the way set a great precedent for the upcoming Gay Tony dlc
-Everything I've seen about the ending, which sounds like a Galactica Season 4 level travesty.

Mediocre: everything else


Side Activities
Good side activities:
Hitman
-Manhunt (because the combat set pieces were mostly decent, and the missions were relatively open in how you approached them)

Passable Side activities:
-Car theft (dinged for silly AI countermeasures to theft, delivery place having no easily accessible taxi hotspot nearby)

Bad side activities:
-Stunt Jumps: normally I have a little fun with these, but the irritating way the game handled healing, death, reloading as well as the vague criteria for success at times made me very risk averse.
-Everything else. Dating, bowling, QUBED, paramedics whatever. I don't do them in games I mostly like, such as SR2 either. But they really clashed with the "realism" twist they tried to add this time, and I thought the phone call based rewards were bullshit. Let me tell you what I really want is to bust out my cell phone when I need something right away.

Core mechanics
Good:
-The original idea for the setting and protagonist had a lot of interesting dimensions. They pissed away all of that good will, but I'll still count it as the game gave a great first impression.
-Combat on foot mostly felt great
-Driving without combat was solid
-multiplayer was ok for an afterthought
-The commie radio station
-drunk driving, although I wish it was more than just a gimmick

Bad:
-Ally AI was terrible. Do not attach mission failure to it at every turn.
-In game rewards were appallingly bad. Safehouses, clothes, dates for lame abilities, whatever. Just terrible.
-Dating and date activities
-Craplist and fake internet generally. .hack did a more credible job, and that was not a good game or one that games in this genre should emulate.
-Money was worthless, despite being your character's supposed motivation. Hey Roman, how many millions should I accrue before I can stop being a bag man? Many -open world games, particularly those with Bad Guy main characters, confront this eventually, and while some try to compromise between the thuggery on display and your status, GTA4 boldy chooses to completely ignore any attempt to reconcile it
-Driving while shooting was garbage. With no coop and no allies who could shoot worth a damn, this was significant
-No value to cars or reason to get anything nicer than whatever's driving by. Garage mechanic was shit, I especially liked it when I'd take a taxi home and he'd pull up into the rear of my sportscar.
-Healing. Fuck calling 911, and fuck the hospital
-Equipment and respawning.
-NO CHECKPOINTS.
-Toll Booths. Seems small, reflects the way that the selective realism of the devs was wrongheaded from the ground up


What I'm getting at here is not that I want you to agree that GTA4 sucks. That's fine, and I can see where someone would prioritize the stuff I put under "good" and not mind the rest so much. But I never will, and Fortinbras can eat a dick if he thinks his act is going to convince anyone of anything other than his need for that dick. What I would like to avoid is an endless cycle where I explain to you my reasoning and you reply with NO TASTE FOR CRAFTSMANSHIP or chapter 3452 in your passionate feud with Creexuls.
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True or false - the PS3 is an irrelevant joke nowadays NT by i_hate_goons.vbs 05/26/2009, 7:49pm PDT NEW
    False, it's a very relevant joke NT by Fussbett 05/26/2009, 8:07pm PDT NEW
    Ironic you would say that now by Lizard_King 05/26/2009, 8:20pm PDT NEW
        Re: Ironic you would say that now by 05/27/2009, 2:17am PDT NEW
            Recent games in sandbox genre that are superior to GTA4 by Lizard_King 05/27/2009, 3:43am PDT NEW
                gta4 was a pretty good game aside from the FRIENDS simulator NT by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/27/2009, 4:07am PDT NEW
                Where the fuck do you get off with Saints Row 2? by Worm 05/27/2009, 7:35am PDT NEW
                    The minigames are trivially easy by Lizard_King 05/27/2009, 4:36pm PDT NEW
                        Yeah, but it bored the shit out of me. by Worm 05/27/2009, 4:56pm PDT NEW
                            OK. by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 3:05am PDT NEW
                                GTA4 had what, 3 kind of bad missions? by Worm 05/28/2009, 7:08am PDT NEW
                                    Let me assist your memory using mine by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 10:33am PDT NEW
                                        fag NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 11:03am PDT NEW
                                            I'm glad we could resolve this amicably. NT by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 11:12am PDT NEW
                                                Yeah, I saw that list and immediately realized you cared more about GTAIV. by Worm 05/28/2009, 11:22am PDT NEW
                                                    Looks like you're trolled by Saints Row 2 (and you have all bad points). NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 11:33am PDT NEW
                                                        TROLLY TROLLED BY T(ROLL)HE TROLLOSPHERE NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 11:54am PDT NEW
                                                            This post doesn't add anything it's pretty worthless. *hand to chin* NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 12:01pm PDT NEW
                                                                (Deconstruction) NT by Fullofkittens 05/28/2009, 12:21pm PDT NEW
                                                                    wrom cuts off little pieces of his victims until they die. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 12:27pm PDT NEW
                                                                        ... on the internet forums NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 12:28pm PDT NEW
                                                                            You mean "on the internet forums.... he doesn't do that." NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 12:30pm PDT NEW
                                                                                I mean wait "... no he really does" NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 12:34pm PDT NEW
                                                                                    But you said it so it's not true. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 12:37pm PDT NEW
                                                                                        no NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 1:11pm PDT NEW
                                                                                            *giant explosion engulfs your corpse* NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 1:15pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                *corpse was fake* *escapes through a mold chute* NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 1:19pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                    *into a blast furnace the end* NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 1:31pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                        *spoiler all the worms were fake* NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 2:17pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                            The real one was dead the whole time. *time travels* NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 2:30pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                *actually he portal gunned away from the blast furnace* NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 2:38pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                    *into a second even larger blast furnace fueled by nuclear explosions* NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 2:55pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                        *also my portal gun only portals into the lava dimension wait ... shit * NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 2:57pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                        Surely Creexul won't childishly demand the last word here. NT by MURDER THE CABLES 05/28/2009, 2:57pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                            Please stop trying to ruin this thread that I'm improving. ^_^ NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 2:59pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                                Re: Please stop trying to ruin this thread that I'm improving. ^_^ by bink 05/29/2009, 5:27am PDT NEW
                                                                Yeah, well, FUCK YOU. *bullet time slo-mo hand to chin dodges troll bullets* NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 12:27pm PDT NEW
                                        WHAT DO WE WANT? DICKS! WHEN DO WE WANT 'EM? NOW! WHAT DO WE WANT? NT by HOMPH! WHEN DO WE WANT IT? HURMPH 05/28/2009, 11:39am PDT NEW
                        LK ended up being exactly right about this NT by irony 12/22/2012, 8:32am PST NEW
                Just Cause? Really? REALLY? NT by Fortinbras 05/27/2009, 8:50am PDT NEW
                    Re: Just Cause? Really? REALLY? by Lizard_King 05/27/2009, 4:33pm PDT NEW
                        Just Cause IS a pretty cool game. ^_^ by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/27/2009, 4:36pm PDT NEW
                        Well, certainly the gaming press will ask Rockstar the tough questions NT by don't fucking bet on it 05/27/2009, 4:50pm PDT NEW
                        Re: Just Cause? Really? REALLY? by Fortinbras 05/27/2009, 7:24pm PDT NEW
                            just cause didn't make you shoot 250 pigeons by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/27/2009, 11:24pm PDT NEW
                                Neither did GTAIV, you dumb fuck by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 1:38am PDT NEW
                                    with bortinfras logic, you can claim that fun things are "boring" by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/28/2009, 1:44am PDT NEW
                                        Jhoh, change your brothers diaper, he's shitting his pants. AGAIN. NT by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 1:50am PDT NEW
                                            bloatinfries is intellectually defeated, falls back on diapers NT by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/28/2009, 2:51am PDT NEW
                                            How about the diaper on your face to soak up all your Just Cause tears? 8( NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 5:14am PDT NEW
                                    Re: Neither did GTAIV, you dumb fuck by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 3:01am PDT NEW
                                        Re: Neither did GTAIV, you dumb fuck by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 3:34am PDT NEW
                                            Re: Neither did GTAIV, you dumb fuck by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 5:11am PDT NEW
                                                Are you sure you played GTAIV? by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 10:37am PDT NEW
                                                    Don't flip your keyboard because you're a moron! by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 11:11am PDT NEW
                                                        Maybe you were playing GTAIII but thought it was GTAIV? by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 11:17am PDT NEW
                                                            Re: Maybe you were playing GTAIII but thought it was GTAIV? by Ice Cream Jonsey 05/28/2009, 11:50am PDT NEW
                                                                No, save system is still a pain. You get 4 save points instead of 1, I guess? by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 11:58am PDT NEW
                                                                    Re: No, save system is still a pain. You get 4 save points instead of 1, I gues by Ice Cream Jonsey 05/28/2009, 12:02pm PDT NEW
                                                                        It's not, given what everyone else is doing in other games by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 12:28pm PDT NEW
                                                                            Lost and The Damned has mid-mission checkpoints. Slowly getting there- NT by Gutsby 05/28/2009, 2:57pm PDT NEW
                                                                                That's progress. by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 2:59pm PDT NEW
                                                                                    1, that's terror, 2, that's terror, 3, NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 3:04pm PDT NEW
                                                                                    Whatever, let's go get us some hole. NT by Gutsby 05/28/2009, 3:07pm PDT NEW
                                                                                GTA4 and GTA SA also did. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 3:08pm PDT NEW
                                                                Shit. I meant N.A.R.C. Not Crackdown. NT by Ice Cream Jonsey 05/28/2009, 3:07pm PDT NEW
                                                                Are you sure you don't mean a TIAMAT of input? That would be a lot funnier by Nyuk nyuk comics' Gabe 05/28/2009, 5:45pm PDT NEW
                                                    Re: Are you sure you played GTAIV? by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 7:03pm PDT NEW
                                                        Maybe you should go back to QT3, just maybe. NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 7:10pm PDT NEW
                                                            You fuck one goat and then... NT by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 9:52pm PDT NEW
                                        Hahah holy shit, you're going to criticize their development cycle? by Worm 05/28/2009, 7:21am PDT NEW
                            Re: Just Cause? Really? REALLY? by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 2:47am PDT NEW
                                Weren't we talking about checkpoints and ease of access? by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 3:29am PDT NEW
                                    Who's "all of us", you dumb motherfucker? by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 5:16am PDT NEW
                                        He doesn't care about craftsmanship because he has no fucking taste! NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 7:11am PDT NEW
                                        You've sure showed me the error of mocking Jsoh with your trenchant reply! by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 10:23am PDT NEW
                                            Do you know what a red herring is? by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 10:58am PDT NEW
                                                Re: Do you know what a red herring is? by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 11:11am PDT NEW
                                                Holy shit, why is everyone a faggot about sand box games? by Worm 05/28/2009, 11:14am PDT NEW
                                                Re: Do you know what a red herring is? by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 11:15am PDT NEW
                                                    Re: Do you know what a red herring is? by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 11:39am PDT NEW
                                                        I knew Assassin's Creed was shit the moment I ran into a giant spinning double h NT by Entropy Stew 05/28/2009, 11:47am PDT NEW
                                                        Re: Do you know what a red herring is? by HOMPH! WHEN DO WE WANT IT? HURMPH 05/28/2009, 11:55am PDT NEW
                                                            Nice ATOR, shit drinker. NT by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 2:46pm PDT NEW
                                                                Haha, what? NT by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 3:32pm PDT NEW
                                                                    Exactly. NT by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 4:00pm PDT NEW
                                                                        Re: Exactly. by Fortinbras 05/28/2009, 4:09pm PDT NEW
                                                                            You contribute exactly zero NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 4:33pm PDT NEW
                                                                                Joey's had it with some of the regulars. He's not going to stand for this. NT by Souffle of Pain 05/28/2009, 4:37pm PDT NEW
                                                                                    I just want to highlight this. by Souffle of Pain 05/28/2009, 6:36pm PDT NEW
                                                                                        The only poster worth keeping here is I Need Clarification and Fussbett. NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 7:12pm PDT NEW
                                                                                            Whoa, another dumb faggot comes out of his lurking to realize he needs more NT by time in the oven 05/28/2009, 7:49pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                Is that a Holocaust joke? You think Holocaust jokes are funny? "Cool" NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 7:52pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                    jewey NT by Worm 05/28/2009, 7:54pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                        New lows 24/7/365: Worm, Creexul, Weyoun. NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 7:58pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                            Joey NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 8:01pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                Nice post, Worm. You spelled my name right. NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 8:10pm PDT NEW
                                                                                                                    Joey NT by Joey 05/28/2009, 8:38pm PDT NEW
                                                                                            Huge slam on INC and Fussbett out of nowhere. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/29/2009, 6:56am PDT NEW
                                                                            EITHER WAY, THIS IS LOW POINT. FOR YOU! by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 7:00pm PDT NEW
                                                                                If you're the kind of pussy we send into Iraq, no wonder we're losing. by Worm 05/28/2009, 7:51pm PDT NEW
                                                                                    If you're the kind of pussy we send to his mother's basement by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 9:51pm PDT NEW
                                                                                        Not the "you're bad at games" argument, the "this part wasn't that bad" argument by Worm 05/29/2009, 6:27am PDT NEW
                                                                                    wromg is wromg and doesn't know that we're winning. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/29/2009, 6:58am PDT NEW
                Re: Recent games in sandbox genre that are superior to GTA4 by 05/27/2009, 4:29pm PDT NEW
                    Re: Recent games in sandbox genre that are superior to GTA4 by Lizard_King 05/28/2009, 5:22am PDT NEW
                    Haha Sims 3 you really are a FAGGOT. NT by Creexuls, a monster >:3 05/28/2009, 5:31am PDT NEW
            I start a game up, and it makes me go bowling by Entropy Stew 05/27/2009, 7:28am PDT NEW
    You're banned. NT by Cioxx, former SomethingAwful mod 05/26/2009, 8:22pm PDT NEW
    I would probably buy one for Gran Turismo 5 + backward compatibility... by Jerry Whorebach 05/26/2009, 8:41pm PDT NEW
        play GT1, case closed NT by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/26/2009, 11:32pm PDT NEW
    so is gta4 a bad game? by Weyoun Voidbringer 05/28/2009, 3:07am PDT NEW
    I officially tested the stun punch thoroughly enough to be sure it doesn't work by Weyoun Voidbringer 09/27/2009, 8:43pm PDT NEW
 
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