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by jeep 03/19/2012, 1:24pm PDT |
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Ice Cream Jonsey wrote:
It fucking sucks that the guys who did New Vegas didn't get their bonus. I feel for them. It blows and with the money that game made for their publisher, it's fucking sickening that a little more couldn't be broken off for the people who did the fucking work.
The bonus was for devs, but there was also a payment for obsidian itself, and that's why people lost their jobs. Either they were operating on the hope they'd get the bonus anyway, or Microsoft canceling their project forced them to go to Bethesda and beg for it. Either way that's an operational fuckup. The market for rpgs is strong, the market for games via steam is strong, their product is strongly differentiated, they have a huge fanbase, there's no excuse for the company to be run on a shoestring.
Maybe instead of the bonus, Bethesda could have offered them a similar-sized investment in another product partnership. On the other hand Bethesda might have seen how they operate and decided 1) risk was too high to be worth a second investment or 2) wait a bit until they're in even worse financial straits and pick them up as a west coast development office for a song. Not that this exact thing happened to a company I worked at a few years ago.
Really I haven't seen any evidence that Obsidian didn't essentially go bankrupt from the failure of their internally-developed ip Alpha Protocol and they've just been limping along on goodwill since.
There's no way to look at this that doesn't suck. Obsidian has as hard a time as Troika/Black Isle did getting games shipped without bugs, but when it comes right down to it they're the company with the best chance of making the kind of game I want to play. In the same way some people are gonna give molyneux or will wright free passes forever, I'm pretty much on board with whatever avellone (and sid meier) make.
But God. Metacritic. On one hand, they're mostly all dickslurpers. On the other, New Vegas was a C+ game. So it's telling that it got an "84." Then again, Metacritic converts scores that aren't out of 100. Then again, game publishers are doing it to themselves. According to Schaefer he got ... let me look it up to be sure.... ok.... zero fucking dollars from game publishers. Zero. Activision used to send $100 worth of shit to be awarded to people in the Interactive Fiction Competition. Now, they're all such pieces of shit they can't break off $100 to hand over to a guy who's made them millions.
But yes, lesson learned for anyone who is making games on the same sort of deal as these guys: as terrible as games journalism is, it's just terrible enough to ensure you don't get the money you deserve.
This can't really be a surprise to anyone, no one does business with Activision or EA anymore unless they're ready to sell their company. No one should do business with them at all. The Metacritic thing is entirely, 100% on the CEO of Obsidian. If he had a board and investors, they'd demand he fall on his sword for it. Or think of it in football terms: it's dumber than the time Ricky Williams let Master P negotiate an incentive laden contract for him. Fucked up his whole career, probably cost him $50M over the course of it.
I read that New Vegas made $300 million or something. Un fucking real.
Well that's what I mean by "how did that bonus not get turned into an investment in the next game?" Bethesda's owned by Zenimax now, they're being careful or they know things about Obsidian's operations that we don't. |
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Bump this thread every time devs cut staff after a game launch NT by Souffle of Pain 10/11/2010, 1:02pm PDT
Raven by Souffle of Pain 10/11/2010, 1:03pm PDT
The only "downloadable content" I want from Raven is Take No Prisoners on XBLA by Jerry Whorebach 10/11/2010, 3:10pm PDT
Re: The only "downloadable content" I want from Raven is Take No Prisone by laudablepuss 10/11/2010, 3:39pm PDT
Awesome. I guess this makes you the Take No Prisoners of Caltrops posters? NT by Jerry Whorebach 10/11/2010, 8:17pm PDT
EA Canada by Souffle of Pain 10/28/2010, 10:23am PDT
Re: EA Canada by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/03/2010, 7:50am PST
Interesting thing about games being late by Fullofkittens 12/03/2010, 7:57am PST
Re: Interesting thing about games being late by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/03/2010, 10:48am PST
Valve? by motherfuckerfoodeater 12/03/2010, 10:59am PST
Re: Valve? by Mysterious Stranger 12/03/2010, 1:24pm PST
Re: Valve? by motherfuckerfoodeater 12/03/2010, 2:38pm PST
Agile development and commercial games by The Happiness Engine 12/03/2010, 3:45pm PST
Re: Agile development and commercial games by Bananadine 12/03/2010, 4:17pm PST
Games with a subscription model fit the paradigm better, I think by Fullofkittens 12/07/2010, 9:38am PST
3 YEARS LATER... by Fullofkittens 02/20/2014, 6:27pm PST
Re: EA Canada by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/03/2010, 8:37am PST
That strong stalwart of California, EA Canada. NT by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/03/2010, 8:40am PST
EA threatens to lay off Tiger Woods by Ray of Light 12/06/2010, 8:48pm PST
Re: EA threatens to lay off Tiger Woods by Ice Cream Jonsey 12/06/2010, 10:26pm PST
Re: EA threatens to lay off Tiger Woods by blackwater 04/10/2014, 9:02am PDT
Bizarre Creations by Souffle of Pain 11/17/2010, 11:48am PST
Disney closes Propaganda Games, makers of Tron: Evolution. by Jerry Whorebach 01/19/2011, 2:19pm PST
Closing the whole studio after a project is some scorched earth shit. by Some new games journalist should 01/21/2011, 3:01am PST
Can that article be written in the form of pasted press releases? by Ice Cream Jonsey 01/21/2011, 7:30am PST
:( NT by Blues News 01/21/2011, 6:35pm PST
Turns out the guy who invented Geometry Wars is named Stephen Cakebread. by Jerry Whorebach 01/24/2011, 3:34am PST
Team Bondi (L.A. Noire) by Ice Cream Jonsey 09/02/2011, 10:23am PDT
Re: Team Bondi (L.A. Noire) by jeep 09/04/2011, 12:45pm PDT
The Bank of America Confidence Game is almost over so they're laying off 30000 by jeep 09/15/2011, 9:24pm PDT
Visceral Australia? by The Happiness Engine 09/19/2011, 11:32pm PDT
It's too bad they DIDN'T wait until their game launched to fire these guys. by Jerry Whorebach 09/20/2011, 12:30am PDT
The subject of the above post is not Visceral Australia, but another developer NT by mentioned in the same article :( 09/20/2011, 12:34am PDT
CCP 20% layoffs (120 people) NT by jeep 10/19/2011, 7:15pm PDT
This is the thanks they get for rushing EVE Online out the door! NT by Eight years of gainful employment! 10/20/2011, 1:00am PDT
It was mostly the World of Darkness team that got axed NT by Entropy Stew 10/20/2011, 9:55am PDT
HAHA WOW by WITTGENSTEIN 10/20/2011, 3:34pm PDT
nah he's a big KOTOR fan he'll just switch to that by jeep 10/21/2011, 7:01pm PDT
"I used to control a space empire of nerds. Bow before me." NT by Darth Mittani 11/01/2011, 12:52pm PDT
he used to make let's plays of the kotor games by jeep 11/05/2011, 3:31pm PDT
that was the wrong link sorry NT by jeep 11/05/2011, 10:49pm PDT
Re: he used to make let's plays of the kotor games by E. L. Koba 11/06/2011, 11:48am PST
a child drew it by jeep 11/06/2011, 3:49pm PST
Silicon Knights down to 25 people after X-Men: Destiny by Horrible Gelatinous Blob 10/31/2011, 9:13pm PDT
NetDevil closes Play Well Studios, 115 jobs gone NT by jeep 11/08/2011, 8:09pm PST
I interviewed with them once. by Ice Cream Jonsey 11/08/2011, 8:55pm PST
Re: I didn't by jeep 11/16/2011, 7:29am PST
Day 1 Studios (F.E.A.R. 3, MechAssault) I heard maybe 100 people by jeep 12/04/2011, 7:34pm PST
GSC Game World CEO Hryhorovych Announces Closure Of Company by McMoo 12/12/2011, 8:39am PST
That is a disaster. :( NT by Eurotrash 12/12/2011, 9:21am PST
That is very sad by motherfuckerfoodeater 12/12/2011, 9:24am PST
Get out of here, Stalker NT by The KGB 12/12/2011, 12:50pm PST
I felt Stalker just kept getting worse with every game they made by The Happiness Engine 12/12/2011, 11:33am PST
CoP was easy mode. NT by Gutsby 12/12/2011, 6:22pm PST
If you were good you could get an exoskeleton within the first 3rd of the game by WITTGENSTEIN 07/12/2012, 4:29pm PDT
I was just grateful for more Stalker goodness. Gameplay and balance was always by Eurotrash 12/14/2011, 5:07am PST
Metro 2033 was terrible. Like a haunted house train-ride. by The Happiness Engine 12/14/2011, 10:53am PST
Metro 2033 development floundering without anyone from whom to steal by motherfuckerfoodeater 02/03/2012, 11:38am PST
Duke Stalkem Forever by motherfuckerfoodeater 01/17/2012, 7:12pm PST
id Software by jeep 01/11/2012, 3:18pm PST
unrelated by laudablepuss 01/11/2012, 3:41pm PST
there's not gonna be a fallout mmo, maybe play f2p Fallen Earth to see why by jeep 01/11/2012, 4:21pm PST
Re: there's not gonna be a fallout mmo, maybe play f2p Fallen Earth to see why by Brandon Flick 01/11/2012, 9:12pm PST
Re: there's not gonna be a fallout mmo, maybe play f2p Fallen Earth to see why by jeep 01/12/2012, 11:36am PST
I still can't believe Bethesda paid $7,750,000 for the rights to Fallout. by Jerry Whorebach 01/11/2012, 9:24pm PST
I think the Troika people who didn't end up at Obsidian by jeep 01/12/2012, 11:33am PST
I don't *think* there are any ex-Troika people at Bethesda, but I could be wrong by Jerry Whorebach 01/12/2012, 1:23pm PST
my mistake bethesda got the guys from black isle by jeep 01/12/2012, 2:12pm PST
THQ confirms 240 job cuts, CEO takes pay cut by jeep 02/02/2012, 2:15pm PST
Since 2008, THQ has laid off nearly 700 people. NT by jeep 02/02/2012, 2:45pm PST
Eat Sleep Play laid off eight employees last week as it finishes Twisted Metal by jeep 02/07/2012, 7:45pm PST
Re: jeep's longings by N 02/07/2012, 9:09pm PST
so fr most of them are casual games by jeep 02/08/2012, 7:22am PST
Re: so fr most of them are casual games by N 02/08/2012, 4:34pm PST
thanks by jeep 02/08/2012, 7:50pm PST
TM is going so suck so hard :( by M. Knight Trekkie 02/09/2012, 5:46am PST
Jaffe recently gave a talk on why games shouldn't try to tell stories. by Tansin A. Darcos (TDARCOS) 02/09/2012, 4:10pm PST
This ator exposes TDARCOS as the fictional character we all expected. NT by But do we even care at this point? 02/11/2012, 9:58am PST
Re: This ator exposes TDARCOS as the fictional character we all expected. by The Happiness Engine 02/11/2012, 5:04pm PST
Doublefine? by Entropy Stew 02/09/2012, 6:47pm PST
Re: Doublefine? by jeep 02/10/2012, 4:36pm PST
Obsidian 20-30 employees by jeep 03/15/2012, 8:59am PDT
Sooner or later game developers will start pulling Tonya Hardings on reviewers. NT by Mischief Maker 03/15/2012, 1:29pm PDT
no but maybe companies that aren't over a barrel will stop signing by jeep 03/16/2012, 10:57am PDT
Re: no but maybe companies that aren't over a barrel will stop signing by Ice Cream Jonsey 03/16/2012, 5:11pm PDT
Clarification by Ice Cream Jonsey 03/16/2012, 5:17pm PDT
That "people who did the work" thing made you out to be a commie. NT by Gutsby 04/03/2012, 7:03pm PDT
Metacritic definitely isn't the problem by jeep 03/19/2012, 1:24pm PDT
6waves Lolapps lays off dev staff by jeep 03/20/2012, 7:20am PDT
Zynga buys developers of Draw Something for $180 million by + $30mil for "employee retention" 03/22/2012, 7:59pm PDT
not layoffs but it's sufficiently tragic by jeep 03/22/2012, 8:33pm PDT
It only took 40 people to make "Pictionary, but on a mobile phone"? NT by They ARE geniuses! 03/22/2012, 10:54pm PDT
didn't make them millionaires by jeep 04/01/2012, 11:03am PDT
hahaha, they just closed the studio by fabio 06/06/2013, 12:01am PDT
Snooped by 4 minutes! NT by fabio 06/06/2013, 1:39pm PDT
Activision buys Candy Crush developer for $5.9 billion by fabio 11/03/2015, 6:16pm PST
THQ 118 developers NT by jeep 03/30/2012, 10:31pm PDT
BioWare cuts 'Star Wars' staff by you guys are right about this 05/22/2012, 11:26am PDT
I can't find how many by jeep 05/22/2012, 8:59pm PDT
38 Studios and Big Huge Games Lay Off Entire 379-Person Workforce by jeep 05/24/2012, 3:04pm PDT
Lum came out of hiding to cover it by jeep 05/26/2012, 1:15am PDT
I know 2 of them through friends of friends by secrets 06/09/2012, 10:29am PDT
I don't know anything about full sail by jeep 06/09/2012, 9:21pm PDT
They're the most infamous of the "game school" degree mills for rich kids by TRUTH SIREN! 06/10/2012, 9:14pm PDT
THQ wipes out San Diego studio by jeep 06/05/2012, 9:24pm PDT
Radical Entertainment closes by jeep 06/28/2012, 4:23pm PDT
Getting that Prototype PC patch ain't looking good. NT by Ice Cream Jonsey 07/12/2012, 12:58pm PDT
They said they held on to enough people to ship it by jeep 07/12/2012, 3:04pm PDT
Re: They said they held on to enough people to ship it by Ice Cream Jonsey 07/12/2012, 3:33pm PDT
Maybe you can blame Radical by fabio 07/12/2012, 4:45pm PDT
Rockstar Vancouver closed, 35 employees: move to Toronto or lose your jobs NT by jeep 07/10/2012, 11:09am PDT
Rich Vogel has "left" BioWare Austin plus layoffs by jeep 07/17/2012, 3:08pm PDT
Microsoft Vancouver lays off 35, cancels Microsoft Flight NT by jeep 07/26/2012, 8:10am PDT
the two guys who founded Bioware by jeep 09/18/2012, 9:48pm PDT
All of PopCap Ireland NT by jeep 09/25/2012, 8:20pm PDT
Over 100 at Zynga, Boston office, most of Austin, Chicago, Japan, UK by jeep 10/24/2012, 7:32am PDT
everyone working there got what they deserved NT by Souffle of Pain 10/24/2012, 9:20am PDT
Could never understand why Brian Reynolds went there NT by Roop 10/24/2012, 5:03pm PDT
The severance package? NT by Mischief Maker 10/24/2012, 7:02pm PDT
Haha, true. BR IS all about strategy games NT by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/24/2012, 10:47pm PDT
he got in really early by jeep 11/26/2012, 7:31am PST
Re: Over 100 at Zynga, Boston office, most of Austin, Chicago, Japan, UK by motherfuckerfoodeater 10/24/2012, 9:19pm PDT
Re: Over 100 at Zynga, Boston office, most of Austin, Chicago, Japan, UK by Ice Cream Jonsey 10/24/2012, 10:40pm PDT
Isn't Denver a city? by The Happiness Engine 10/25/2012, 4:20pm PDT
This is actually a boom time of an unprecedented number of start up studios... NT by That make mobile games. 10/26/2012, 12:32am PDT
EA - SEALTeam 6 by Rafiki 11/09/2012, 6:45am PST
I thought breaching in bullet time was just a dramatic effect by Entropy Stew 11/09/2012, 2:47pm PST
Eurocom sheds staff, from over 200 to less than 50 by Concerned Fan Of Awful Shovelware 11/23/2012, 4:37pm PST
filed for bankruptcy yesterday NT by jeep 12/07/2012, 8:19am PST
I feel like this was my fault for not even thinking about buying Sphinx and the by Cursed Mummy. 12/07/2012, 9:03am PST
30 at Petroglyph by jeep 12/07/2012, 8:16am PST
So that doesn't really apply to this thread, does it? NT by Caltrops Administrative Review Boar 12/07/2012, 10:42am PST
Petroglyph should have been taken out and shot a long time ago by WITTGENSTEIN 12/07/2012, 5:09pm PST
Re: Bump this thread every time devs cut staff after a game launch by Souffle of Pain 12/17/2012, 2:02pm PST
Valve lays off 25? by jeep 02/13/2013, 1:16pm PST
Disney shut down Junction Point after Epic Mickey 2 by Rafiki 02/13/2013, 1:54pm PST
The power of two ^_^ NT by Disney 02/13/2013, 2:34pm PST
EA Montreal by Souffle of Pain 04/15/2013, 12:26pm PDT
Released on the last Tuesday of the fiscal quarter, aka SENT TO DIE NT by Mysterio 04/15/2013, 3:29pm PDT
turns out it was more than half the people in EA working on mobile by jeep 04/16/2013, 9:33pm PDT
LucasArts closes? by jeep 04/18/2013, 8:16am PDT
EA again "10% of the workforce" NT by jeep 04/25/2013, 12:52pm PDT
Zynga 520 people by jeep 06/03/2013, 1:30pm PDT
Longbets on when Facebook will start hemorrhaging NT by fabio 06/03/2013, 1:41pm PDT
I don't know but there's a pattern to web marketing by jeep 06/05/2013, 7:07pm PDT
Important to note this includes closing OMGPOP entirely, just 1 year after purch NT by $200 million well spent. 06/06/2013, 11:57am PDT
word is the purchase cost them 2-3 times that if you factor in the cost of NT by operation since 06/07/2013, 6:10pm PDT
So... video game creator sounds like a great job... haha NT by meeps 06/06/2013, 12:46pm PDT
no and it's about to be a lot worse by jeep 06/07/2013, 6:17pm PDT
Re: no and it's about to be a lot worse by Mysterio 06/07/2013, 6:38pm PDT
let's take this to another thread by jeep 06/07/2013, 7:03pm PDT
IO Interactive, makers of Hitman and Kane and Lynch, ~50% of workforce NT by jeep 06/18/2013, 7:38am PDT
Hadn't released a good game in 6 years. NT by WITTGENSTEIN 07/17/2013, 2:30pm PDT
we've been shown up by jeep 08/02/2013, 9:12pm PDT
Twelve Crystal Dynamics employees have lost their jobs. NT by jeep 08/13/2013, 7:11am PDT
all of 2K Marin NT by jeep 10/17/2013, 3:44pm PDT
Interwave 6 developers of Dark Matter by jeep 10/23/2013, 7:52am PDT
Victory Games closed after F2P Command & Conquer is cancelled by Horrible Gelatinous Blob 10/29/2013, 1:27pm PDT
every ea exec who came from another game company by jeep 01/07/2014, 8:29am PST
Did SB get fired today? by - 02/18/2014, 10:47am PST
I can't believe he actually said he was shitcanning people to go "find himself" NT by WITTGENSTEIN 02/18/2014, 11:01am PST
Levine is a tool. NT by A god damn tool 02/18/2014, 12:00pm PST
wow by jeep 02/18/2014, 3:30pm PST
Gamasutra on why it's so hard to report on this when you aren't a real journalis by Fullofkittens 02/19/2014, 5:57pm PST
"But I might not be a very good journalist" by Game Dev Spin Cycle 02/19/2014, 8:51pm PST
Re: "But I might not be a very good journalist" by Ice Cream Jonsey 02/20/2014, 6:53am PST
Quote from a developer by Entropy Stew 02/20/2014, 10:05am PST
"like, real capital-J journalism." Ergh? NT by RetroRomper 02/20/2014, 7:56pm PST
Meanwhile in Capital-J Journalism by jeep 02/23/2014, 5:31pm PST
Attn aspiring games developers/screenwriters: there's more to life than fiction! by Jerry Whorebach 02/23/2014, 6:51pm PST
Systems with procedurally-generated narratives and environments... by Fullofkittens 02/23/2014, 7:27pm PST
you're right about ken levine not being suited for that kind of game by jeep 02/24/2014, 8:17am PST
Sony Santa Monica (God of War) cancels unnamed game and lays off 50 NT by jeep 02/25/2014, 6:44pm PST
Eidos Montreal releases Thief, 27 employees... NT by pinback 03/05/2014, 2:11pm PST
EVE Online developer CCP said today it is canceling its long in development MMO by jeep 04/14/2014, 8:34pm PDT
airtight games released murdered soul suspect and then closed down by jeep 07/02/2014, 9:11pm PDT
Don't get Murdered, it's $50. Wait for a sale. NT by I guess 07/02/2014, 9:47pm PDT
well they put out quantum conundrum too and that was mediocre by jeep 07/03/2014, 5:40pm PDT
Avalanche for Just Cause 3 by Souffle of Pain 11/02/2015, 7:14pm PST
When asked why the developers were fired, a pointy-haired boss answered, NT by "Just Cause." 11/02/2015, 11:20pm PST
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