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An explanation. by blackwater 06/25/2018, 5:41pm PDT
An explanation.


The latest furor over Trump immigration policy involves the separation of children from parents at the border.

As usual, the outrage obscures more than it illuminates, so it’s worth walking through what’s happening here.

For the longest time, illegal immigration was driven by single males from Mexico. Over the last decade, the flow has shifted to women, children, and family units from Central America. This poses challenges we haven’t confronted before and has made what once were relatively minor wrinkles in the law loom very large.

The Trump administration isn’t changing the rules that pertain to separating an adult from the child. Those remain the same. Separation happens only if officials find that the adult is falsely claiming to be the child’s parent, or is a threat to the child, or is put into criminal proceedings.

It’s the last that is operative here. The past practice had been to give a free pass to an adult who is part of a family unit. The new Trump policy is to prosecute all adults. The idea is to send a signal that we are serious about our laws and to create a deterrent against re-entry. (Illegal entry is a misdemeanor, illegal re-entry a felony.)

When a migrant is prosecuted for illegal entry, he or she is taken into custody by the U.S. Marshals. In no circumstance anywhere in the U.S. do the marshals care for the children of people they take into custody. The child is taken into the custody of HHS, who cares for them at temporary shelters.

The criminal proceedings are exceptionally short, assuming there is no aggravating factor such as a prior illegal entity or another crime. The migrants generally plead guilty, and they are then sentenced to time served, typically all in the same day, although practices vary along the border. After this, they are returned to the custody of ICE.

If the adult then wants to go home, in keeping with the expedited order of removal that is issued as a matter of course, it’s relatively simple. The adult should be reunited quickly with his or her child, and the family returned home as a unit. In this scenario, there’s only a very brief separation.

Where it becomes much more of an issue is if the adult files an asylum claim. In that scenario, the adults are almost certainly going to be detained longer than the government is allowed to hold their children.

That’s because of something called the Flores Consent Decree from 1997. It says that unaccompanied children can be held only 20 days. A ruling by the Ninth Circuit extended this 20-day limit to children who come as part of family units. So even if we want to hold a family unit together, we are forbidden from doing so.

The clock ticking on the time the government can hold a child will almost always run out before an asylum claim is settled. The migrant is allowed ten days to seek an attorney, and there may be continuances or other complications.

This creates the choice of either releasing the adults and children together into the country pending the ajudication of the asylum claim, or holding the adults and releasing the children. If the adult is held, HHS places the child with a responsible party in the U.S., ideally a relative (migrants are likely to have family and friends here).

Even if Flores didn’t exist, the government would be very constrained in how many family units it can accommodate. ICE has only about 3,000 family spaces in shelters. It is also limited in its overall space at the border, which is overwhelmed by the ongoing influx. This means that — whatever the Trump administration would prefer to do — many adults are still swiftly released.

Why try to hold adults at all? First of all, if an asylum-seeker is detained, it means that the claim goes through the process much more quickly, a couple of months or less rather than years. Second, if an adult is released while the claim is pending, the chances of ever finding that person again once he or she is in the country are dicey, to say the least. It is tantamount to allowing the migrant to live here, no matter what the merits of the case.

A few points about all this:

1) Family units can go home quickly. The option that both honors our laws and keeps family units together is a swift return home after prosecution. But immigrant advocates hate it because they want the migrants to stay in the United States. How you view this question will depend a lot on how you view the motivation of the migrants (and how seriously you take our laws and our border).

2) There’s a better way to claim asylum. Every indication is that the migrant flow to the United States is discretionary. It nearly dried up at the beginning of the Trump administration when migrants believed that they had no chance of getting into the United States. Now, it is going in earnest again because the message got out that, despite the rhetoric, the policy at the border hasn’t changed. This strongly suggests that the flow overwhelmingly consists of economic migrants who would prefer to live in the United States, rather than victims of persecution in their home country who have no option but to get out.

Even if a migrant does have a credible fear of persecution, there is a legitimate way to pursue that claim, and it does not involve entering the United States illegally. First, such people should make their asylum claim in the first country where they feel safe, i.e., Mexico or some other country they are traversing to get here. Second, if for some reason they are threatened everywhere but the United States, they should show up at a port of entry and make their claim there rather than crossing the border illegally.

3) There is a significant moral cost to not enforcing the border. There is obviously a moral cost to separating a parent from a child and almost everyone would prefer not to do it. But, under current policy and with the current resources, the only practical alternative is letting family units who show up at the border live in the country for the duration. Not only does this make a mockery of our laws, it creates an incentive for people to keep bringing children with them.

Needless to say, children should not be making this journey that is fraught with peril. But there is now a premium on bringing children because of how we have handled these cases. They are considered chits.


So basically, this whole thing was just a lie (surprise, surprise). The immigrants and their families were only ever split up if they claimed asylum. And those applications were overwhelmingly frauds. Anyone with a legitimate asylum claim could just make it at the US embassy in their home country-- there's no legitimate reason to make the dangerous trip to the US in person to make it. (There is an illegitimate reason, of course: you can skip bail and just disappear into the US after making your fake asylum claim.)

So this whole moral panic was not only a lie, but the exact opposite of the truth, since it encouraged more migrants to come across with children. So more kids raped and killed by smugglers during the crossing.

Of course, explaining this to people is impossible, due to all the propaganda. So Trump just decided to start detaining the parents and the children together. And now the usual suspects are complaining about "concentration camps" and so forth. No matter how dumb you think people are, they're dumber than that. Can we just cut to the chase and let Mexico annex us? At least we could get some decent fast food.
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Let's ban political discussion by Worm 06/18/2018, 11:16pm PDT NEW
    "Can we ban things I don't like? The fetal alcohol spectrum disorder prevents me by from just ignoring them :(" 06/18/2018, 11:28pm PDT NEW
        No one likes it, even if you think you like it you're just emotionally damaged. NT by Worm 06/18/2018, 11:36pm PDT NEW
            How about we just ban you and your stupid interjections from political discussio by the emotionally damaged. 06/18/2018, 11:41pm PDT NEW
                Yeah ban me a guy everyone loves to make room for #qanon chats between druggies NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 7:22am PDT NEW
                    Maybe we can have a special forum for jsoh and TDARCOS to sperg at each other in NT by an endless loop. 06/19/2018, 4:52pm PDT NEW
        Caltrops should declare itself a communication medium only by Like an ISP or something 06/19/2018, 5:31am PDT NEW
    For the record, I regret siding with jsoh over Zseni all those years ago. by Mischief Maker 06/19/2018, 6:50am PDT NEW
        If you truly liked Contra you'd be posting the 12 steps in the YouTube comments NT by Spoony slide incoming 06/25/2018, 8:29pm PDT NEW
    Can we just ban laudablepuss? NT by fuck him and the liver he rode in o 06/19/2018, 7:10am PDT NEW
        For asking a question? NT by MUH FREE SPEECH 06/19/2018, 8:02am PDT NEW
            there are 2 puss posts: anodyne NFL shit and white collar liberalism NT by both are bad 06/19/2018, 8:37am PDT NEW
                And you contribute... what exactly? NT by Mischief Maker 06/19/2018, 9:21am PDT NEW
                    We contribute reality checks when needed. Also some stuff about games by Mysterio 06/19/2018, 11:55am PDT NEW
                        So MM is Jimmy Dore and Laudable is an even more dishonest Cenk? NT by The Miserable Liberal 06/19/2018, 12:29pm PDT NEW
                        You don't think I'm in favor of Net Neutrality, BLM, asylum, and LGBTQ rights? by Mischief Maker 06/19/2018, 12:49pm PDT NEW
                            Why do you never destroy your opponent and instead "define" them and attack by that hilarious new definition? 06/19/2018, 1:03pm PDT NEW
                        Yeah really need a reality check on the Rumpelstiltskin border defense policy. by Worm 06/19/2018, 1:25pm PDT NEW
                            "If you kill your enemies, they win" by Justin Trudeau 06/19/2018, 1:34pm PDT NEW
                                oh boy chantard shit NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 1:38pm PDT NEW
                                    Said the Twitter fairy. Why don't you put me on a block list, faggot? NT by Justin Trudeau 06/19/2018, 1:39pm PDT NEW
                                        So you can't go on twitter because people block you? by Worm 06/19/2018, 2:05pm PDT NEW
                                            Worm, twitter is every bit as gay as the name. Yelling at each other without mod by bias is why Caltrops is still valid 06/19/2018, 2:13pm PDT NEW
                                                No one likes it, it's not an argument, it's just a fact. by Worm 06/19/2018, 2:23pm PDT NEW
                                                    Re: No one likes it, it's not an argument, it's just a fact. by him? 06/19/2018, 2:47pm PDT NEW
                                                        You're already a twitter user, you just do it on this site for your pride. NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 4:06pm PDT NEW
                                                            Re: You're already a twitter user, you just do it on this site for your pride. by the emotionally damaged. 06/19/2018, 4:22pm PDT NEW
                                                                You can't do anything for ego on a site no one cares about. NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 5:23pm PDT NEW
                                                                    Oh so you acknowledge your fucking point was invalid before you made it. NT by Brilliant. Excellent posting. 06/19/2018, 5:25pm PDT NEW
                                                                        Nope I said pride, not ego. NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 5:26pm PDT NEW
                                                                    Also pride is personal, obviously you think there's something 'special' here. by Worm 06/19/2018, 5:25pm PDT NEW
                                                                        Your discomfort at this point. NT by Now I think I'll stay 06/19/2018, 5:30pm PDT NEW
                                                                            condemning yourself to this site NT by to own worm 06/19/2018, 5:53pm PDT NEW
                        Haha reality checks by laudablepuss 06/19/2018, 3:53pm PDT NEW
                            spending what's left of your borrowed lifespan due to organ donors NT by on owning the cons 06/19/2018, 4:45pm PDT NEW
                                It's the easiest form of entertainment on the net! NT by Mischief Maker 06/19/2018, 5:07pm PDT NEW
                                    But it's boring. Everyone thinks they're doing agitprop. Nobody's NT by clicking on your YT links 06/27/2018, 5:28pm PDT NEW
                                Please stop projecting your idiocy onto me by laudablepuss 06/19/2018, 5:38pm PDT NEW
        I mean laudablepuss at least believes in what he's saying. by Worm 06/19/2018, 9:22am PDT NEW
    No way NT by Vested Id 06/19/2018, 9:52am PDT NEW
        What unique experience does it provide beyond 'fighting with names you remember by from 20 years ago'? 06/19/2018, 1:28pm PDT NEW
            The "unique experience" of expressing SURGE impressions-- far more fulfilling. NT by but I'm not an escapist manchild 06/19/2018, 2:05pm PDT NEW
                The Surge has more inherent value than all philosophy or politics. by Worm 06/19/2018, 2:09pm PDT NEW
                    You believe Laudable came to Caltrops to be soothed? Do you think so little of NT by him? 06/19/2018, 2:19pm PDT NEW
                        No he came to be upset. I'm just saying he could just shut his hand in a door. by Worm 06/19/2018, 2:25pm PDT NEW
                            thanks church of wromg NT by Creexuls :(, a sinner 06/19/2018, 2:45pm PDT NEW
            It keeps the site alive for one NT by Vested Id 06/19/2018, 3:47pm PDT NEW
                I never understood the Terri Schiavo thing by Worm 06/19/2018, 4:03pm PDT NEW
    You guys need to lighten up. by blackwater 06/19/2018, 5:32pm PDT NEW
        Tdarcos is the only reason I visit here anymore. NT by That is what this has done. 06/19/2018, 5:35pm PDT NEW
        Secret Hint: Worm is the only one not having fun here. by Elián González 06/19/2018, 5:35pm PDT NEW
            fake news NT by to own worm 06/19/2018, 5:54pm PDT NEW
            Yes by Vested Id 06/19/2018, 6:58pm PDT NEW
        WOOOAH! REALLY??? Check out Mr. Fresh Ideas over here! NT by Mischief Maker 06/19/2018, 6:49pm PDT NEW
            Yes, you, point that particular finger NT by Vested Id 06/19/2018, 7:31pm PDT NEW
                Lighten up, man! It's just kids being traumatized on the taxpayer dime. NT by Holy Shit 06/19/2018, 7:38pm PDT NEW
                    Where do you get these great ideas NT by Vested Id 06/19/2018, 7:51pm PDT NEW
                    Are we talking public schools now? I have a bit about CORE Knowledge... by A can of worms. 06/19/2018, 7:56pm PDT NEW
                        guy who will never adopt or help anyone in his life worried about kids NT by to own mm 06/19/2018, 8:02pm PDT NEW
                            It's creepy as fuck when you project your "humanity" on anyone worm. by I said "a can of" 06/19/2018, 8:04pm PDT NEW
                                suck my dick, fag NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 9:27pm PDT NEW
                                    Re: suck my dick, fag by can of revulsion 06/19/2018, 9:48pm PDT NEW
                    An explanation. by blackwater 06/25/2018, 5:41pm PDT NEW
                        That's the key article on this, yeah, but by Vested Id 06/25/2018, 6:15pm PDT NEW
                        Did you even read that fucking article? by Mischief Maker 06/25/2018, 8:30pm PDT NEW
                            Re: Did you even read that fucking article? by Vested Id 06/25/2018, 9:08pm PDT NEW
                                Well clearly YOU didn't read the article! NT by Mischief Maker 06/25/2018, 9:14pm PDT NEW
                                    Yeah I did, don't be a piece of shit NT by Vested Id 06/26/2018, 12:12am PDT NEW
                            Man, Bashar al-Assad is such a cunt even the Mexicans are seeking asylum. NT by Hillary was right all along 06/25/2018, 9:49pm PDT NEW
        If that's right, then what about my feelings? by ICE agent with Independent tattoo 06/19/2018, 9:04pm PDT NEW
            Wait so we're already on the Jews? NT by Worm 06/19/2018, 9:13pm PDT NEW
        I agree with you, but those screeching idiots seem more insufferable lately NT by Roop 06/20/2018, 4:17am PDT NEW
            Screeching like terrified children being used as political hostages? NT by BUILD THAT WALL! NO HUGGING! 06/20/2018, 6:25am PDT NEW
                This is an excellent point by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 9:30am PDT NEW
                    Cracked wide open #qanon #pizzagate #maga #biginsertions NT by Worm 06/20/2018, 10:30am PDT NEW
                        You really are forum cancer NT by aren't you? 06/20/2018, 10:33am PDT NEW
                            obummer did it first dems #maga #qanon #saveourtips #bringbackourgirls NT by Worm 06/20/2018, 10:40am PDT NEW
                                Are you having a seizure? The fuck is wrong with you? NT by Seriously. 06/20/2018, 10:51am PDT NEW
                                    I'm just saying obama did it first, summer camp, #maga NT by Worm 06/20/2018, 11:19am PDT NEW
                                        Man, Caltrops really was your personal Worm Tumblr, wasn't it? NT by And now the temper tantrum 06/20/2018, 11:26am PDT NEW
                                            Yes the assault on my personal stronghold the place I love and use so often by Worm 06/20/2018, 11:30am PDT NEW
                                                You are going full sperg to protect the virtue of m'lady. Noted. NT by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 11:37am PDT NEW
                                                    Hey man you've already won! You're on the site I really really really love. by Worm 06/20/2018, 11:46am PDT NEW
                                                        Caltrops survived Barborito's wiping it and Zseni's granny apocalypse. by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 11:51am PDT NEW
                                                            I just thought 'controlled media' and acting like I give a shit about this hole by was retarded lol 06/20/2018, 11:56am PDT NEW
                                                                also the stupid little kid in the cage was a protest, everyone knew that by Worm 06/20/2018, 11:57am PDT NEW
                                                                    Re: also the stupid little kid in the cage was a protest, everyone knew that by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 12:04pm PDT NEW
                                                                        galaxy brain centrist should be your new name NT by Worm 06/20/2018, 12:18pm PDT NEW
                                                                            Re: galaxy brain centrist should be your new name by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 12:27pm PDT NEW
                                                                Re: I just thought 'controlled media' and acting like I give a shit about by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 12:02pm PDT NEW
                                                                    Telling me I'm smashing the faggy snowglobe of your politics threads won't stop NT by Me Worm 06/20/2018, 12:16pm PDT NEW
                                                                        Faggots gotta fag, I understand nature. NT by the emotionally damaged. 06/20/2018, 12:17pm PDT NEW
    TFW the motherfucking news discussion bleeds into the thread about banning it NT by to own the cons 06/25/2018, 7:13pm PDT NEW
    Best troll since when I released the Caltrops Killfile NT by Entropy Stew 06/26/2018, 7:18pm PDT NEW
 
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